BIM IN ASSET MANAGEMENT MONTHLY FORUM, 17-06-2024
RICHARD This is our second BIMinAM monthly forum meeting. We’re going to go through a lot of stuff, some of it will be background, some of it will be context, we’re going to do a poll which will flow through on to further meetings. We ask everybody in BIM in asset management to participate, that could be leading a group, participating in a workstream, or it could be just telling you mate at the next desk that we’ve got a publication out that could be of interest. George, for 30 years you’ve been doing BIM, you’ve been doing BIM since before they called it BIM. You’ve worked on government task-force, you’ve led initiatives, you name it you’ve done it. Why do we need another one?
GEORGE That’s a very good point. I think what we’re doing here is getting into the detail that is a bit more cross-industry because most of the other initiatives are led by organisations that are perhaps like the Centre for Digital Built Britain, or indeed NIMA. NIMA is actually made up of members, but again most organisations, most of these initiatives are driven by the institutions, in many ways. Whereas what I think we need is someone looking at things from a very practical point of view in the industry and it’s a matter of bringing together people that are cross-industry and working collaboratively. So that’s what I think we manage to do and to some extent that will be answered in what I’m just about to present.
(shares screen). As Richard was saying, why do we need it. What we’ve done is looked at things from a, obviously we’ve got the regulations that are driving change and we’ve got an overwhelming number of different liabilities and potential risks that could impact on things. But in many ways, what we’re being asked to do is to guarantee what people should have already have been doing and that’s designing inline with building regulations. But not just designing, but also when you’re replacing things from an asset management point of view making sure that you’re following that same regime. So you need to record what was installed and also record when things have been changed, that’s during the life or during construction.
In many cases people say that that information that’s actually being recorded in the BIM, or it will be in the O&M, or it will be in the Regulation 38 pack, but in our experience that probably isn’t the case. So the devil is in the detail in this and we do need to address it. One of the big drivers is the fact that with the new regulations there is a serious risk of delays and indeed prosecution. If you look at the timeline on this you’ll see that over half of this is given to design and construction and then we jump to 5 years, 10 years and 15 years. So there is no real detail being added to that and that’s because I think the asset management side of things hasn’t really been engaged in a lot of the new information standards, whereas that’s I think the role that we’ve got to really fill. We need to be providing that level of input so that BIM actually, properly, addresses what asset management teams need.
One of the challenges with that is that people tend to look at a lot of the information as being commercially sensitive and something that gives them competitive advantage, so everybody invents their own. We then end up with a lot of effort going in to creating silos of information. With BIM4Housing, we looked at it differently and set up[ collaborative groups from people that are actually competitors, in many cases. But they were able to come together in what we created to look at the things that were of common interest, not giving away stuff that’s that confidential, but actually if your staff know what you’re doing then if they move to another company they take a lot of that knowledge with them anyway.
So that was something that everybody looked to collaborate on and share and the way in which we did that was by looking at things from a point of view of different teams and giving them problems to solve. You’ll see here we’ve got designers, all of those people at that table there are all manufacturers, over in the far corner there all operations people. All from different companies, potentially competitors, but they’re solving problems collaboratively and learning from each other which we think is the right way of doing it. So, we’d give somebody a task, say that a fire breaks out in that kitchen, and what we want the experts to do is to tell us what measures are in place to actually protect against it and how do we need to address that.
What we were then doing is looking from these subject matter experts to say OK, what information do we really need to know about fire doors or smoke dampers. We came up with a way of doing things where we said what was the risk that it mitigated, so we’re asking common questions of the key asset types. All of this information was then shared freely amongst anybody that really wants to see it. So. we’ve got this deep dive of what information is needed and also what do people do to fire doors to stop them from working properly. And then what information do you need to install it, maintain it, what competencies is needed etc. And up on the BIM4Housing website we’ve got a really rich set of information on all of those asset types.
More recently we came up with some things that would cause problems in breaking the golden thread. For example, the wrong product being selected, or how do we address the fact that M&E services, for example, isn’t being procured until too late in the process and that impacts on compartmentation. From an asset management point of view how do we make sure that the information about that penetration seal is consistent right the way through its life. And how do we make sure that the building safety data isn’t just an outdated snapshot in time. We’ve had over a hundred people contribute to that over the last year and we had a session at Digital Construction Week two weeks ago, we were actually working out how best to…this information now is going back to the government.
One of the key things that everybody is now recognising is that the laws have changed, the building regs have changed and now client organisations have got to confirm that they’ve got everything that they need, from a fire safety point of view. And also design and construction teams have got to deliver this, but asset managers also have to maintain this as well. We’ve been trying to get from the experts what information is needed from a fire safety point of view and also look at the ways in which that can be constantly maintained. A final part of this is the type of collaboration, those organisations are all competing, but what they’ve done is they’ve looked at some things that were fundamental issues that can only be fixed at an industry level.
And this is the sorts of things that we’d like to be able to look at from BIM for Asset management perspective. So being able to move the whole process forward so that design actually is completed before construction starts. And we’ve also got in our community some people who are already pushing the envelope on this, Willmott Dixon, for example, with their yellow book and that type of activity. Again, that’s something that is helping their whole supply chain. And one of the challenges we’ve got that we can look at from an industry-wide level is how do we get from a situation where we’ve got building regulations referring to 800 different standards to having structured data where things aren’t just delivered in something that a human has to read and interpret. And also classifications, here we’ve got a whole range of different classifications that have been put together about products and assets that need to be rationalised.
If you’re simply referring to a standard to try and interpret something, the decision process of procuring something relatively simple, like a fire damper, is pretty complex. So, we need to figure out ways of simplifying that so that it’s done in a rigorous way. Part of the process that we’ve done there is to set information requirements that can then be tested against product information and then when products are selected, when they go through the technical submittal process we’ve actually got a way then of ensuring that what gets installed actually does satisfy the golden thread. And again, making sure that that is tied back into the delivery process so that asset managers end up with something that they can then onwardly maintain.
I’ve just listed there some of the things that I think asset managers are interested in and they’re already going through that process in isolation of figuring out what works and what doesn’t work. If in BIM in Asset Management we can do the same as we’ve done in design and construction with BIM4Housing and pull people together I think we’ll get to the answer much more quickly, rather than everybody reinventing the wheel. And it’s not altruistic, it’s something that actually we need to do to move away from the situation of everybody racing to the bottom. Sodexo have offered to do a presentation in September of the work that they’ve been doing and have actually set up a specialist group of subject matter experts called the Asset Management Services to actually deliver information, deliver services on that to that their operating businesses.
Equans are going to do one in October, so we’d like volunteers for November and December. What I want to do is to try and move us away from a race to the bottom and actually make it a race to the top. So, that’s broadly where we’re at. I’d like to ask a couple of people that are actually on the ground in delivering some of these things to just contribute the work that they’re doing. Jarek, could you show the collaborative work that we’re doing on the Miro board?
JAREK WITYK (shares screen). What we’ve done, there’s so many contributors as you can see on the list here, but mainly working with Das and Simon and George, we created this workflow guide of trying to give you a guidance for asset registration in regards to building safety and following the key legislation and what needs to be done to make sure that you’re compliant with current regulations. And whether you’ve got an existing asset, whether this is a new project, this document will help you to identify whether your asset is to be treated as high risk and whether it needs to be registered or not. We published a revision P01 for comments and at the moment we haven’t got much feedback, so if you could comment that would be helpful and we’ll make this guidance much better than it is.
But it’s seriously quite a good guidance, all of it was done by contributors. What you see here is probably 12 months of work put together on to a few pages as a diagram workflow which tells you what to do and when, and there’s hyperlinks to government websites with more guidance, basically the source of the information. This is all updated, as much as we could for now, with ISO 19650 information exchange management and we’ve got the 3 gateways and information showing what needs to be done at each stage.
RICHARD It’s useful to actually see some of the stuff that we’ve already been working on. Alan Oliver has done a standardised fire door inspection document. This is very relevant, because although we did one that was specifically for residential, Alan had already done a health one, so we’re going to spread that right across the sectors.
ALAN OLIVER I’m a member of NAHFO (National Association of Health Care Fire Officers) and having recognised that there were no standardised systems for inspecting fire doors in hospitals we, a NAHFO London working group, wrote a paper on how to do it and we turned it into a reference document. And then about two years ago, I met up with George at a Sodexo training module in Manchester and George got to hear of this document and he said could we create residential version of it, which we did. So there it is, and there’s a now an electronic copy and a hard copy of a BIM4Housing version of how to inspect fire doors, this is fire doors inspections in residential buildings.
The interesting thing that’s come out of this is that while we were writing this version of the document we across things that were relevant for this version of the document. And this was already a 2nd edition because people are always coming up with new ideas, and we’re now in the throes of creating a 3rd edition of that which is coming off of the back of things that we’ve learnt in here. Things like additional information on fire escape doors, that’s perfect example. Roy Buckingham of Assa Abloy, he gave us a tremendous amount of detailed information, as George said earlier the devil is always in the detail and we’ve now got more things to add to this health care version.
This is a collaboration, it’s different working groups who are focused on doing one thing and their coming up with new ideas and new stuff and similarly the NAHFO working group has also written a document on how to inspect fire dampers, fire stopping and cavity barriers and we’re creating a BIM4housing residential version of this. And if anyone on here today wants to get involved in the peer reviewing of this once we’ve got a draft to issue I’d be very happy to hear from them.
GEORGE We’ve got a couple of people, Alan Wheal from ERS and also Joe Allen from FCS, both of whom are either doing inspections of key assets and replacements. One of the things I’d like you’re view on is to say how important it is to actually have information about the assets that you’re going to be working on and how is does that help.
ALAN WHEAL We have a business of approximately 500 staff and 100 million revenue and we span new build construction in high-rise offices and data centres and we go all of the way across to looking after some of Birmingham’s housing associations direct with hundreds of thousands of properties. The challenge for us as a life safety, fire safety business is always at an asset management level. And you know there is a variety of ways that we can do that, but IT is performing that service for us now. Up until now we haven’t had the field service engineers able to collect data at site level and get it on to a system, on to a repository, so it’s been very difficult to actually asset manage age, location etc.
BIM, we’ve been working on for 15-20 years on the commercial, what I call the prima donna side and that’s forced upon you by a system of things that if you don’t have BIM designers you’re not getting the job. So, it’s good, it’s relevant, the issue I have is that trying to get a job designed before you go and build is not construction. A lot of our delays are due to people learning how to do BIM properly and how to all collaborate on one system and to get a set of designs right that can then be installed correctly with the right golden threaded information, etc. And we still have at least 50% of our clients that just want to destroy any value we're creating by design and building valuing for themselves. And we’re continually fighting that fight, it’s so difficult that it’s unbelievable.
Our design teams have floated from 2 people in a £10 million business to 8-10 people in a £10 million business, so the design teams are getting bigger and the problems are getting more as we try to learn and develop BIM skills. And what i find more frustrating than anything is these jobs are getting completed. If we take an example of a high-end office block in London, we’ll complete it, the BIM won’t be correct now and then the fit-out contractor goes in and rips it all out and starts again. And they have no relevance to asset management at all, they just want to get the job done and get out and hand it over to the maintenance contractor who then needs us to tidy up all of their asset management data. That’s the real world…
GEORGE I’d just like to, there’s a lot of people on this call who probably aren’t involved in new build, I know you’re involved i both sides of things. But Joe, you do a lot of work in terms of compartmentation surveys and things like that, could you give us a couple of minutes on your experience?
JOE ALLEN When you go into an existing building to review the fire stopping and there is no Regulation 38 folder, O&Ms are missing or they are only part information, it’s very difficult to complete an accurate survey. You have to make a lot of assumptions, the manufacturers of fire stopping materials have a lot of similarities, but each one has their own unique product and each product has its limitations. And the test evidence is what gives that limitation, so without the O&Ms you do have to base everything on the minimum performance, or has it been installed correctly.
We have the same with fire doors as well, if there is no label on a door because it’s been painted or it’s been removed or somebody has planed the label off, you have to treat the door as a nominal or notional fire door. And if you’re going down that route there are minimal requirements, but that is down to the competency of the particular inspector to determine whether that door is compliant or would provide a particular fire performance. What we find a lot of other inspectors do is literally say it’s not compliant, put a new one in.
But you can actually make a nominal or notional fire door, or even existing fire stopping through some kind of identification, some of the BAT? 26mins 5secs manufacturers, for example, have different patterns on the face to stand them out, or for identification purposes and you can start to trace back, but it’s a very long winded and a very difficult process without any historical information.
GEORGE And I think this is perhaps an indication of the type of expertise that we’ve already got in the room that’s starting to surface. I think the more we can talk to each other and sharing those challenges, we’ll actually get to some potential solutions.
RICHARD Jiss is going to post into the chat a poll that we’re running. Click on the link that Jiss has posted.
GEORGE Part of the challenge is that even though in design and construction we’ve spent the last 2 or 3 years getting our heads around what the responsibilities are, I think asset managers haven’t really had that same opportunity to do that. So the purpose of this is to just get a feel for the sorts of questions that people are asking from an asset management point of view to see where we could perhaps, collaboratively, focus our efforts.
Thew first question is do you know the difference between a principal contractor CDM and a principal contractor Building Safety Act? So, as an asset manager, do you know the difference between those two? The second one, do you know which of your buildings falls under the new Fire Safety Act, or the building safety regulation? Here’s a question that I was asked, if somebody is converting an office to a treatment room in a hospital, so in other words having to put a sink in it and various other things, and its being done by a builder, a plumber, an electrician, does the FM have to appoint a principal contractor and a principal designer? If you replace a fire critical asset with a different model and manufacturer, does that have to go through the same change management process as the Regulator would say for construction? In other words if you’re replacing something in a year’s time, 10 years-time, do you have to go through the same regulatory checks?
The next one is if you commission a fire door inspection, who is responsible for determining which doors are actually acting as fire doors? Is it the contractor doing the inspection? Is it the FM? Or, is it the building owner? If you replace a smoke damper after 10 years do you have to check the original performance specification? Do you also have to check the product specification and get its test evidence? And do you have to check the specification of the wall that it’s going into?
IAN FIELDING I think the questions highlight, certainly to me as a fire risk assessor and lead auditor for ISO standards, is they are diverse and potentially the questions in relation to who does the inspections on the fire doors, I think it has mixed answers because you rely on the principal contractor’s competency and skills to assess it, but then you’d need to make sure that the FM company and the building asset owner were in agreement. But what it highlights to em is the different skill sets that are going to be required to drive this, and you’re absolutely right with everything that I’ve listened to so far. No one specialist can solve this challenge and I think it’s great that you’re highlighting this because it’s going to be sharing of information and experience and knowledge that’s going to drive this forward.
RICHARD Absolutely, I think half the battle with so much of this stuff is that people don’t know that they don’t know.
PAULMcSOLEY Just on number 4, trying to clarify about if you change a product, the key is if you change classification of that product, if it goes up or down is probably the key part to it. If you change the model and product number but actually that’s the same function as the old one, completely is actually correct as the same one it did before, then it’s fine. The thing is it’s a case of it you go up or down it effects what you have to do with the Regulator and obviously if you change the whole size you’ve got an ?? 34mins 16 secs.
GEORGE Absolutely, the only thing I would say on that is that we need to make sure that the records of what that original specification was have been retained because that’s the thing that goes wrong.
MANDEEP SINGH GILL Just to clarify a bit more on what Paul just said, obviously after construction you have to keep a record during the refurbishment, but during construction if something has a fire classification which is an IR then the priority substring…that’s a notifiable change. And if it’s got a lower classification to a fire reaction time then it’s a major change, basically.
PAUL McSOLEY also Mandeep, this is where it’s really difficult is that classification numbers for all of this kit isn’t just resistance to fire, reaction to fire, that’s probably a fault of what the guidance says at the moment because you’ve got resilience in there, you’ve got AA, MA, you’ve got pressures, there’s quite a few different bits to it. i think that’s the bit that’s going to be quite hard for people to determine and actually are we lessening it or are we improving it, that’s the hard bit with it. You said, George, is the language right in the first place, that’s half the battle with this.
RICHARD I want to move on to the workstreams, there’s three workstreams that we set up in our last meeting. Throughout our learnings in BIM4Housing, and it’s going to be the same in this, we’re going to be offered suggestions, solutions, technical product solutions. This needs to be gone into in a very focused way, it’s not appropriate for a meeting like this, so hence we’ve set up those workstreams. And I’m going to ask the leaders of those workstreams to give a quick couple of minutes to tell you what they’re actually doing.
MARC BRADFIELD The working group that myself and Richard Whittaker are working on is developing the business case, so it’s taking very much a higher level view. in order to do that what we’ve actually done is given those on the working group a little bit of homework, having done some ourselves. We’ve put together a collection of food for thought about developing this business case for asset information management and looking very much across sectors, that was really important when we had our initial discussions, to move beyond just residential and move across sectors. Just trying to set out some common terminology, what the buildings are we’re considering, some thoughts in terms of who may need the information, who may be receiving this business case, who are we writing it for and what the information may be.
So, we’ve sent that out to the working group and asked them before the meeting, so that it’s a collaborative process and just to have a think about that, what’s missing, what’s superfluous, what’s irrelevant to it, there’s no right or wrong answers. To think about some personal case studies. What does good look like? And in fact what does bad look like for people? And to have a little bit more of a think about this business case, what’s it going to look like and who will the audience be for the final output? And I think about the priority of tasks for the working group. Our inaugural meeting is on Thursday and specifically for that people just to come along thinking about what do you believe are the benefits of having this information? And, of course, what are the risks of not having it?
And then in the document that I said has already been forwarded there’s some thoughts on what the principles are that should govern the information. So, just come bearing thoughts on that, we want it to be very much an interactive process where everybody has the time to get their point across and their thoughts into this process.
RICHARD Now we’re going to move on to our digital record workstream.
ADINA PONCIS I’m digital delivery director for Durkan, we are a principal contractor working across new builds and refurbishment and retrofit, so we’ve seen both words for existing and new buildings. So while we identified the main topics for our digital record, we want to look more holistically at the information. And for the past 10-20 years we’re getting better with using BIM, having a standard, but how do we ensure that the information is useful when it reaches building completion and it’s handed over to asset managers and facility managers. For this we wanted to look more holistically at the start of the information requirements; are these clear and detailed?
Are the asset list agreed on all of the parties so the client knows what they’re required? What is the expected format of the information that we are delivering? What are the systems? Can the information be interchanged? Ideally, is the facility managers included in the briefing when at the project onset. What are the CAFM systems that the client is using? And making sure we are testing the systems to see whether the information can be transferred from one system to another. Another main topic that we want to discuss is at the information handover, how can we ensure that the client or the building owner has a strategy for maintaining this information? Yes, maybe we are using it, we are handing over our digital information model, but does the client or the building owner have the capability once the building is going through extension, maintenance, do they have the capability to update all of this information/
Another important topic that we want to look at, how can we ensure that the information that we’re producing at the onset or throughout the construction phase of the building is secure enough and it’s structured in a correct format that lasts throughout the lifecycle of a building. Let’s say the building has an expected lifecycle of 80 years how can you ensure that its information is relevant? I now a lot of these topics are going to be crossover across our sessions, so we are potentially looking at having another session, maybe between the workstreams, to discuss what might be the strategy for each of us.
GEORGE I think the critical thing here is that the workstreams are designed as task and finish activities so that we get an output form them. In some cases they’ll morph in to something bigger, so if you’re interested in digital records then please put your name in the chat.
RICHARD Our third workstream is interoperability.
PAUL OAKLEY Interoperability workstream, a big word, but really just breaking it down into some basics. The first thing is we need to identify purposes, what do we need information for. So, under asset management they’ll be hundreds of purposes that are used. There’s the obvious ones, but it could be something as spatial as room booking services, it could be one particular purpose, plus all of the other hundreds of ones associated with it. Then we get down into data requirements in terms of what information we actually need to support those purposes, so for room bookings you’d have spatial ID, room capacity, equipment etc, things associated with it.
Then we go and look at the software solutions, so what software solutions are generally used through the asset management side or that area to make sure that they can basically then look at the last bit which is really the data formats about what information can be imported and exported. So there is four key things we’re really looking at to define what we need information for, what information do we need, what software solutions are used by the parties and what data formats can be imported and exported.
And from that sort of package of work we can then look at how we can then build up things like data schemas, populate data dictionaries and then look at exchange formats in simpler bespoke formats, open formats, down to triples and all of those other things which can come in later on down the line.
GEORGE Part of the thing here is that there has been probably 20 or 30 years of people in the design and construction area defining what those standards are for their purpose. What Paul is looking at here is looking at things through the other end of the telescope to say what do we actually need from an asset management point of view because the purposes will be different. And therefore rather than the design and construction team pushing down to the operations team the standards and requirements, specifications and classifications that work for them, what we need to do is come at it from the other end of the thing.
PAUL OAKLEY One thing that was interesting was in the original CIC under BIM Level 2 working group had representatives from every professional body and industry group looking at BIM, except for asset managers. And I remember almost at the end of the series of meetings over several years somebody finally turned up to represent asset managers who said I know nothing about BIM, but I felt somebody had to be there for that. It just shows we’ve had this disengagement from asset management throughout, hopefully now there is a bit more understanding of what it is and the advantages to them and we can now do that work that should have been carried out 8 or 9 years ago.
GEORGE If you’re interested in that please join interoperability group. The difference between the workstream and the working groups is that workstreams are task and finish exercises, so we end up with something being published. The working groups are looking at things more from a general perspective. So what has been suggested is that we look at things from different types of procurement, so looking at new builds, for example, so having a particular initiative around new builds, existing buildings, but also one that we’ve picked out specially is PFI. That’s because there is a lot of things that some of the members in this group are already getting involved with, so as far as PFI is concerned.
Those are three areas we’d like to see. On the PFI front we’re lucky to have one of the major PFI FM organisations involved, which is Albany, Richard Bacon from Albany is on the call, Albany is a PFI FM manager, so they’re not contractors, they’re actually managing people like Equans, Mighty, Sodexo etc. So, they’re the interface with the client organisations in many cases. We want to get as many people like Richard involved in the scheme because that’s more strategic. So, if you’re interested in existing buildings please put your name in the chat. New build, put your name down for that. And if you’ve got an interest in PFI then please put your name down for that.
GEORGE What do we see as the challenges, for example, on new build as far as the asset side is concerned? Alan has already expressed his experience in that area. Jo from CIBSE, on new build, one of the things that you’ve been involved in, she was at BSRIA, I came across Jo several years ago when she was working with BSRIA and one of the things the team was working on there was soft landings. And I think that soft landings is a really important potential contributor to addressing the problems that Alan was talking about earlier. Jo, could you give a quick explanation of what soft landings is?
JOANNA HARRIS Maybe we should have a poll to say do you understand what soft landings is. It is sold to the industry as a construction FM handover, but actually it’s about engaging the FM in the process of design & build. So it’s encouraging that partnership and handover, it’s the first place that you’ll find the term golden thread, the path of information, that’s where it all started. BSRIA has got plenty of guides on it, they’re all free so nobody should really be unknowledgeable about it. I’m also working the BSI to rethink delivering a guide to the industry on what soft landings is for the FM handover phase, so there is more to come. Give me a thumbs up or a thumbs down if we’re still not hitting the mark, it should work, but people are not engaging with it.
GEORGE That in itself maybe a worthwhile thing for us to consider as part of a workstream to get some explanation on that. Because I think the point that Jo’s just made is a good one and that is that I wonder if people are aware of soft landings as a solution.
NEIL YEOMANS Just to let you know, Ive literally just had funding signed off for a dedicated soft landings manager in my team to implement, explore a soft landings framework for Orbit. So, I’m more than happy to have a wider conversation on that and see if we can work together on it because I completely agree, soft landings is critical to us managing the golden thread and asset management properly, so let’s work it out and sort it out.
RICHARD WHITTAKER A couple of things, in my field where I work in terms of affordable housing and things like that we have a soft landing, it relates to residents. So there is different definitions of soft landings, this one is established and important, but just to let people know that some people might start talking about residents when you start talking about soft landings, rather than asset information. But earlier we were talking about the provision of information and how that works, that was really relevant. I had 43 sites with 23 contractors last year, but when it came to handover and getting the information to handover to asset management, 23 contractors and there were 15 different ways that that information came across. And when you pass that to asset management, they then went thank you very much, threw it in a draw, never to be seen again because it was crap.
What it does for me, it reinforces this group and what i can see from this group in the short time I’ve been involved is that I can just see a code of practice developing across disciplines which cover construction across the industry. And it really is about the design, the construction, the occupation management and disposal of a building and that’s the journey that the information has to go on. And that’s the digital thread that feeds through all of that and I can just see all of that coming together.
What I do see as a potential risk is the target audience and it’s about identifying what audience that we’re looking at. Are we looking at practitioners, where they will need more detail? Or are we looking at the execs? Who don’t really want t know the detail, they just need to know what the output is. And as we continue this journey and build these workshops and things like that, we need to keep that audience identification within it, and that journey.
IAN FIELDING I think one of the challenges that we face all of the time when conducting audits around compliance is really on the existing buildings when so often we’re coming across structures where the architects are no longer in business, we don’t know where the documents are, we’ve got different versions of drawings. It would be interesting to understand how people are addressing that very real challenge that i’m sure that we all face when we’re trying to ascertain the state of assets, whether they be fixed assets in the building and the assets contained within them, but where do we start with that type of challenge?
GEORGE Yeah, definitely, the reason that I was calling Will Boreman in was that he does a lot of work around condition assessments. And often the condition assessment is not adequately specific to an individual asset and therefore the thing that’s being paid for and the thing that’s being recorded is that an inspection was done of a fire door. But inadequate information, in my experience, as to which fire door was actually inspected because people are improving in tagging things, but it’s still the case that there’s not the level of specificity on which asset was actually inspected going forward.
RICHARD WHITTAKER Think of asbestos regulations and the change in asbestos regs. When we were in the middle of that journey we were in the middle of jobs and setting jobs up and things like that, people knew there maybe asbestos but they didn’t know where the asbestos would be. And the information was clear that if it’s not asbestos, treat it as asbestos. Well, that was just an industry killer, if that had of been the case. We went down the route of working with the Health & Safety Executive to get a balance between the base information that was available and instead of trying to chase the information that wasn’t there or may not be there, we had the base information that was available and then added to it by doing sampling surveys and testing and things like that.
And that got signed off by the Health & Safety Executive and it turned what would have been an absolute show stopper into something that actually supported the things going forward. And I think on existing buildings, when you look at high-rise, it was Dame Judith Hackitt who said that when they first asked the question following Grenfell how many tower blocks have you got, hardly anybody knew. And they’ve now got 18,000 tower blocks registered, but that’s taken 4 or 5 years to get into that position because people didn’t know and they couldn’t see what was in it. So you can just see the value of the application of what we’re trying to achieve in this working group.
NEIL YEOMANS Just to make sure that people have seen the link that I’ve posted in the chat that gives a view on how we retroactively BIMed, golden threaded out our buildings. The whistle-stop tour would be we’ve used the UK Housing Data standards to be our asset architecture and to drill through to what component level information that we’ve used, which did about 80% of what we needed. And we filled in our organisation information requirements the remaining 20% with stuff that we’ve worked out ourselves. Anyone working on the Digital Standards Position working group, you’re more than welcome to our OIRs, AIRs, EARs, you can have them. That link you’ll see, you’ll go into a little bit more detail that goes through what we did for the projects.
GEORGE The other thing that I wanted to just table is condition based maintenance because it seems to me that everybody is pressing ahead with the standard that is to do normal planning preventative maintenance. But Jo, could you just give us a quick explanation of what condition based maintenance is?
JOANNA HARRIS If this is a group of asset managers they’d all know, but let’s go with recent developments of technology and the ability to get the assets to tell us what the problems are. It’s about using the data you’ve got from your assets to tailor your maintenance regime. There’s also sort of risk factors, how critical that the asset is to the organisation and how that influences your maintenance regime. So, it shouldn’t just be oh, it’s a pump, so SFG20 tells me visit it every 3 months and that will be that, it will have to be (or it should be) much more information led from now on, you shouldn’t be stuck in your old ways.
GEORGE So that in itself, if people could just put in the chat whether you’re unaware of condition based maintenance because it really is significant, both in terms of risk and also from a cost perspective. I think that would be a useful thing for us to start to understand. Adam, you look at things from a risk-based perspective. The reason I’m saying that is what jo’s just said there, knowing what assets are where and what they’re being used for and their criticality, I know you’ve got some ideas on how that could be used to improve the way that safety cases are put together and risk assessments.
ADAM SANDERS Yeah, our take on data is quite fluid in that you need to be able to store a lot of different types of data on lots of different types of assets and they relate to each other in many different ways. It's not necessarily this idea of very structured tabular data or time all the time. And if you find information out about one asset, that can then trigger rules or it can trigger further assessment of even other assets, or how assets interact within systems. And if you’ve got a failure of one asset, what other issues does it bring about? So, fi the fire alarm doesn’t work, how many other systems does that impact? There are also softer things, non-physical things that it impacts in terms of risk and the operation and management of that building. That was a rally bad explanation, but you caught me off guard.
GEORGE I think that’s really helpful. Rather than just going through the motions of doing fire door inspections, risk assessments and things like that, it’s a matter of being a little bit more strategic.
ADAM SANDERS Yes, I think everything has to be underpinned by strategy and it needs to be, from my perspective everything is risk-based. There are lots of things that we can do and if we follow every single standard out there we’d just be absolutely bogged down in bureaucracy. But, if everything is risk-based we can make some good decisions off of the back of that and then we’d get down to some exciting stuff around AI and employing organisation-wide ways of managing that risk and data.
GEORGE And I think that feeds into what Paul Oakley was saying earlier and that is understanding what the purposes are so that we can then make sure that we can prioritise that.
CHRIS MILLING Just listening into to this, I think it’s the distinction between information and data again which always gets me. We talk about BIM a lot, and then it’s always static when you receive information which is why asset managers or facility managers might throw it in the draw at handover. So, what’s the conversation about standing up digital twins because if things are risk-baaed you send people out that at no point does it sound like people say oh, I’m going to start taking on mapping what is in my asset because we are going out to do inspections, what do we need to know about that.
And just talking about Adam’s point just now, once you start collecting it unless you’ve actually pt that data somewhere and can capture it almost in real time, you don’t know what you’ve got. But nobody, I guess for existing buildings, you need to draw a line and say we’re going to start doing this, we might not have the information and the data now, but why don’t we just start collecting it because we know we’ve got to do our surveys and inspections and so forth. So, what’s being said about starting to stand up proper digital twins that you’re making a proactive effort to capture that data, as opposed to say here’s your document at this time, this is what happened.
GEORGE Yeah, absolutely, I think it would be very useful. Sweco have offered to do a presentation for us on the way they are using digital twins in a proper operational way, so we maybe able to get somebody from Sweco in August to do a session for us. Chris, if you know of anybody that’s doing that successfully. I think from a digital twin perspective, for me having been involved in BIM for a long time, we need to make sure that it is a true digital twin and that it’s not just a 3D model. It needs to be something that is actually active with real, useful information.
ANA MATIC I’m very happy that Sweco are going to do a presentation and I just wanted to say from a point of view I’m kind of resolving the minefield of what is the right amount of information for the client to then manage their key assets later on is basically the gap that we’re trying to bridge at the moment. And this group is doing fantastic work, but I think also the asset management industry needs to be engaged a lot more and this applies to digital twins as well, to make them truly live, as you say.
GEORGE John Morrow, are you able to give a perspective, I know you’ve done some really good work around your Regulation 38 checks and things like that. You’ve been doing a lot of good work over the years around the checking of handover information, could you give feedback on what your experience has been?
JOHN MORROW If I was completely open and honest with everybody, we started collating a lot of that comprehensive set of information a number of years ago. The problem we have now is we’re gathering that information and how we’re storing it is a real problem for us. We’ve used Sharepoint and such like, and that’s not working at all well for us. Our asset teams and fire safety teams can’t always access the information and retrieve information easily and I don’t think it’s being fully utilised. And what it’s meant for us is that we get numerous requests for certification commissioning, technical data sheets, just supporting evidence, supporting information, that we know is already there within the files and folders. So, we’re trying to work out infrastructure issues to make it all work. I think that the principle is sound, absolutely, but it’s really infrastructure issues we’re working on now.
GEORGE It’s also the handover information that you’re receiving isn’t so complete either.
JOHN MORROW No. We put our Regulation 38 checklist in our agreement for leases, the development agreements or contracts. The land-led stuff is a little bit easier, but we make it a contractual commitment for developers to provide us that information on a reasonable timescale. It normally starts at 10 or 12 weeks prior to PC, but even when we’ve made it a contractual commitment it’s still like pulling teeth. Some developers, I think it’s how they manage the information during the construction phase, they’re not storing it, it’s not easily retrievable for them, but it’s a very difficult, time consuming task. It’s worth doing, but it’s a very difficult task, it is like pulling teeth sometimes. Some developers are a lot better than others.
GEORGE One of my ambitions for this group is to put in place some methods by which the information can be captured progressively through the design and construction process and the FMs being part of that. That’s an important part of what Jo was talking about earlier with soft landings. For example, COBie, which is the international standard for handover information for operations from the BIM process, that should be done progressively through the design and construction process. But all too often, it’s left right until the very end, by which stage a lot of people have disappeared from the project. Whereas if it can be done progressively, with the FMs being actively engaged in that process, then I think we’ve got a better chance.
ANA MATIC Just a quick one on COBie, because we’re sorting this out with quite a lot of clients at the moment.The issue with doing it along side of developing the project is that e usually at that time don’t have the FM company onboard, or management company of sorts. And then also the client is not necessarily always the client occupier, the client might be the client developer, the client who’s going to have many tenants later on. So, the information that we would love to collate and put in because it’s easier for us to do COBie as we go along and to kind of march everyone into doing it as well. It’s sort of contradicted y the fact that actually most of the rest of the team is not ready to do it and also the client is often not ready, so the information could either become abortive i.e. we put it in and then later on it has to be changed. Or, it’s simply the basis stuff is not ready, sot that the other stuff can be done. Does that make sense?
GEOEGE It does, but I think the important thing here to recognise is that this asset data, this COBie information, is for the life of the building, so therefore although it may be obviously that it will change, I think you need to recognise that that’s going to happen. What we want to do is we want some practical examples from organisations of what they’re doing, so over the next few months we’re going to be asking people to show us what they’re doing. And Sodexo, for example, we’re working with Sodexo (so are a number of the other people on this call), what we’re doing is Sodexo are going to run a session in September to show what they’re doing. And we’ve got Equans doing a session in October and it might be, Ana, that you could do something.
ALAN WHEAL Doesn’t it come back to this whole purpose of the golden thread, making sure that whatever is designed can’t be changed out during the process of the build. Because that’s been the problem over the years, we design it and then all of it would get changed during the build for cheaper options. We’re now talking about a specific product that is going in to that building for the life of that building. And if that’s all of your life safety assets protected from design change then we can do it early doors. We do tech subs at the very beginning, then it’s just a matter of quantifying what’s gone in through the design of the building as it gets built.
GEORGE Alan, I’m just going to give a quick example of how Sodexo are actually doing that and then we can obviously come on to that. This is a little video that has been produced, so I’[ll just show you that. This isn’t to say this is the way of doing it, but it’s an example. And also it’s an example of somebody wiling to share what they might consider to be their IP, as it were. Because at the end of the day things are going to change anyway. Sodexo basically have set up an operation called asset management services and they’re using a range of different software applications and consultants involved in that process. But what they normally do is they end up getting a lot of disconnected information that might have been models, so what they’re doing is then drawing that together to basically end up with something that is properly coordinated.
In this particular one, this is a PFI development built by a company called Rhatigan, and they’re capturing the information from technical submissions, as well as the COBie data, but they’re also using digital asset capture to do it. So, basically they’ve got schools that they’ve had to do asset capture on that are 12 years old now and they’re actually doing this work without having to send people to site. They’ve got a group fo technical experts in Salford who are using 360 photography to actually go and tag the assets. So, rather than sending different specialists to the sites they’re able to do this remotely and it’s really working well, they’ve now done about 2,500 spaces. And by tagging them in this way they can also then create an asset list that they didn’t have in the outset.
So, I think this is a worthwhile thing to be using the technology for. You see that it’s counting there and checking you’ve not put too many items in that room. Here we’ve got a plant room where the plant, you can have an M&E specialist, here we’ve got the asset list that are supposed to be in that space, or that they found in that space. But, that’s been created through this asset tagging process so that the tags that you’re seeing there aren’t in the 360 photo, they’re actually written to the database. So, the 360 photo is just there to give somebody that’s a mechanical or an electrical specialist the asset information. But then it’s a matter of them connecting it through to, in their case they’ve now connected it through to SFG20 so that the maintenance for that item is also being calculated simply by identifying it.
And then finally what this is doing here, this is checking using Openspace, which is a walkthrough surveying tool, to say what information or what assets are in each space. So they can actually use this to then verify what’s been installed, which is a real challenge normally. Openspace, the contractor is using it to be able to compare the as-built with the real. This is probably the most useful thing because you can actually see what was installed before that ceiling was put up, and then they can then go and verify that information. So what they're doing then is they are tagging that and over on the right hand side you’ll see that the information is being recorded against that particular item. And then they can also search for a particular asset to make sure that they’ve got that it has been installed and you’ve got the documentation for it.
So it’s bringing together the documentation that’s being captured, as Joh was saying earlier, in Sharepoint, but that documentation is then tied back to the individual asset. And the point about this is that it’s being done in collaboration with the builder, so it’s a real strong way of actually delivering the whole process and soft landings. We’re going to be running a session on that in September, but also in October Equans are going to do, they’re using a combination of Fieldview and Viewpoint for some of this.
RICHARD Thank you for coming out, especially in such numbers. This actually I think the biggest meeting that we’ve held, including all of BIM4Housing, so not bad after the first meeting I reckon. Many of you have put your names in the chat for the three workstreams: business case, digital record, and interoperability. And many more of you have put your names in for PFI, existing buildings and new builds. We won’t have another meeting now until September, when we’ll be holding our normal monthly forums. We’ll get the results of the poll out to you over the net week or so, along with the highpoints of the meeting and a link to a recording.
GEORGE I think it’s also the case that we might want to have one-to-one discussions with people, so if you’d be receptive to that, because a lot of this is actually going to come from conversations that aren’t in the group, they’re down to feedback from individuals. So, obviously there’s not many of us, but some of the workstream leads may be able to do that so that we can actually get proper feedback from people as to what information we need to be covering.
RICHARD It’s a conversation and obviously it’s a lot more nuanced than the group meeting , so if anybody is open for that, we’ll be emailing you out about it anyway.
GEORGE Also, if there’s any specific questions that you have from this please let us know. The purpose of this is that we’ve got a community of experts and the likelihood is that whatever question you’re going to ask, somebody is going to be able to answer it. So, if you could that I think it then becomes, ideally we ought to be trying to move to some sort of Wikipedia of this type of information. But obviously, we’re all volunteers so it’s just a matter of trying to do our best.
CHAT
[11:06 am] Simon Collery (External)
Shouldn't 'Building Assurance Certificate' be 'Building Assessment Certificate'?
[11:12 am] David Shepherd (External)
One of the biggest challenges is the disconnect between the objectives of project delivery and operations.
Often, project delivery can be focused on the least effort/cost to get the project ‘over the line’.
The key to changing this mindset is to simplify the process for collating digital asset data and, based on the value of this data, incentivise supply chains to provide these data.
This could be achieved through more alliance-oriented procurement routes.
[11:15 am] Ian Fielding (External)
Agreed, this will take collaboration across the key sectors and systems designed with APIs in mind.
[11:17 am] David Shepherd (External)
Another key point is the ‘agile’ vs. ‘waterfall’ approach. The latter approach aims to collect all requirements before implementing a solution.
As a digital product manager, I would favour ‘agile’ by establishing a backlog of ‘user stories’ and to focus on ‘sprints’, instead of trying to establish a comprehensive set of compliance criteria before embarking on developing even the semblance of a concrete solution.
[11:18 am] Ian Fielding (External)
Looks like a very beneficial document to share. I would like a copy to review and offer feedback
[11:18 am] Debbie
There are also ChatGPT tools on BSA
[11:18 am] Shahi Alom (External)
Interesting, name of Ai tool?
[11:20 am] Debbie
[11:25 am] Jarek Wityk (Guest)
BPMN process diagram for asset owners to determine if their building qualifies as a Higher-Risk Building and to Determine If New Building or Refurbishment Work Must Undergo the Gateway Process. Please feel free to add your comments directly to the
MIRO board via this link:
https://miro.com/app/board/uXjVNZlu1W8=/?share_link_id=838109356194
Password: Bu1ld1ngSafety
[11:26 am] Sue Newton (External)
Hi - I am new here - I am in health and safety and building safety and am happy to work on a particular project, particularly interested to know more about fire stopping works and software we could use for golden thread storage etc.
[11:27 am] Ferreira, Floriano (Unverified)
Happy to assist Sue.
[11:28 am] Ian Fielding (External)
www.fireIE.uk will help manage fire assets using QR codes. It also has a built in fire risk assessment using PAS79 to capture inspections.
[11:29 am] Sue Newton (External)
Thanks we use Propeller to manage fire doors but will have a look at this.
[11:32 am] Paul McSoley (External)
4
If you replace a fire-critical asset with a different model and manufacturer, does that have to go through the same change process as is defined by the Regulator for construction.
Just to clarify, if the classification of the new product goes down, then Yes, If the classification goes up - No.
If the hole size changes then its notifiable.
[Yesterday 11:33 am] David Shepherd (External)
So, I’d suggest that we adopt the bookkeeping approach to data quality, which is known as reconciliation.
What do you do when you discover a charge in your bank statement that isn’t recorded in the ledger?
You compare them and make changes to ensure that they are consistent.
In the same way, extensive laser scanning (esp. before void closure) can ensure that any missing data in the handover model can be identified and reconciled.
[11:33 am] Sharon McClure (External)
Owner
[11:38 am] William Borthen (External)
Great concept David...I like it. Information Management is the cornerstone of Asset Management, and there is often misalignment with the resources and budget to manage the level of information specified.
[11:43 am] Paul McSoley (External)
Just some notes, DW145 Fire Damper is being revised, Watch out for the BESA publication due in the near future.
Also NAAD22 is free rto download on fire dampers. NAAD22 Guidance Document/App – NAADUK
[11:43 am] Alexandra Cleave Wallace
Happy to join! Alexandra cleave Wallace -precision lifts
[11:44 am] Sue Newton (External)
I am happy to join the business case work stream - I have drafted my own BC. But I think I would get more personally from the Digital Records Workstream.
[11:48 am] Ian Fielding (External)
We are using ISO9001 and ISO27001 to help manage records and digital transformation, but happy to share information as some really big questions that still need answers. In particular whole life cycle of information
[11:48 am] Paul (External)
Interoperability Workstream
Tasks - Identify:
- Purposes
- “What do we need information for?”
- Data Requirements
- “What information do we need?”
- Software Solutions
- “What software solutions are used?”
- Data Formats
- “What Data formats can be imported and exported?”
[11:49 am] Nicholas Nisbet
Interoperability is the ability of information to exist independent of the creation tools and the consumption tools.
[11:49 am] Bailey David (R0A) Manchester University NHS FT (External)
Have you talked to Nema about their Interoperability COP? Paul Wilkinson, Fiona Moore have done good work on this.
[11:53 am] Ian Fielding (External)
What is the general thoughts on old buildings and gaining retrospective information?
[11:56 am] Neil Yeomans (External)
there's a case study from my team on this link: https://www.housing.org.uk/our-work/building-safety/good-practice-case-studies-and-resources/ just scroll down to the golden thread video
[11:56 am] Sue Newton (External)
For us on new build - we do maintenance walk throughs with our existing technical experts - we still get it wrong sometimes.
[11:58 am] Sue Newton (External)
Yes I would also be interested in soft landings to see where we can stop issues we have experienced above.
[11:59 am] Paula Chandler (RDD) (External)
The terminology we use is 'Plan for Use' to drive consistency in approach and outputs on our projects. Would be happy to support the Soft Landings working group to share experiences and insight.
[11:59 am] Rachel Heaton (External)
Interested in soft landings - Design and linking of data - Digital thread as mentioned by Richard is key.
[12:07 pm] Marc BRADFIELD (Unverified)
Neil Yeomans (External), very interested in an anything you can share on OIR, EIR and AIRs
[12:08 pm] Richard Bacon (Unverified)
always been interested in Condition and Risk Based Maintenance
[12:10 pm] Andrew Perry (External)
Risk Based needs a full assessment of -how the asset supports the business critical activities - what is the impact on the business - what is the risk / probability of failure based on current condition & reliability etc. Take into account OEM Obsolescence and support timelines for spares, software etc
[12:11 pm] Neil Yeomans (External)
No probs - they're fairly big files, so I'll need to get one of my guys to send them over to you.
[12:13 pm] Ian Fielding (External)
Digital twins are a great way to capture the fixed assets. www.twinnedit.com are our partners and making some great headway in this field and tech
[12:14 pm] Martin McDonald (External)
there isnt always a necessity for a digital twin - in most cases a digital shadow would be sufficient its important not to get bogged down with providing too much if smaller data sets will suffice
[12:17 pm] Lucas Cusack (External)
Kier, Glider and Future Decisions have developed a working prototype digital twin for MOJ on one of their prison blocks. I'd be happy to present it on the next call. It currently focuses on baselining occupant behaviour against energy usage and has uncovered 20% in potential energy savings so far. It's as much to do with analysing performance data from BMS and IoT as it is with BIM. But it connects the 2
[12:17 pm] Nicoleta Bocaneala (External)
I also think, when we look at digital transformation and "digital twins" it's important to understand the size and scale of the project, what the issue is and what can we do to solve it rather than investing in a new piece of kit that's selling the "digital twin" dream but may potentially not solve the issue at hand
[12:17 pm] Richard Whittaker (External)
Composition and provision of AM info should be linked to milestones and payment, similar to the CDM model.
[12:18 pm] Sue Newton (External)
I am a newbie - can someone link to one of the handover forms/list of data please - like COBE? I mean I am not an asset manager.
[12:18 pm] Benedicta Anetekhai (External)
George Stevenson not all building projects are BIM projects unfortunately and this makes things even worse. I do agree with all you said, though.
[12:19 pm] Nicholas Nisbet
COBie is fully defined - search 'NIBS COBie'
[12:19 pm] Martin McDonald (External)
I have just dropped a stage 5 COBie report the client was happy the FM team emailed me and said they couldn’t understand it... Had to do a separate Asset register just for the FM team
[12:20 pm] Lucas Cusack (External)
sadly, i only ever experience this scenario
[12:23 pm] Adrian Mokus (External)
happens all the time
[12:20 pm] Chris Milling (Unverified)
Manage the assets on a single platform and give suppliers and contractors access to the assets they need to see e.g. AIMS, the asset register by datb
[12:21 pm] Ian Fielding (External)
Happy to share our plans to further develop www.assettagged.com
[12:22 pm] Chris Milling (Unverified)
Need someone to own/host the platform for this. Don't know who that would be
[12:24 pm] Ian Fielding (External)
This is the future of asset management.
[12:24 pm] Martin McDonald (External)
there was a talk on this at dcw by nemetschek. they are looking at training AI to recognise the assets from the 360 photos
[12:26 pm] Simon Newton (External)
currently look at the same workflow - utilising openspace or oculo. for higgins projects.
[12:26 pm] Chris Milling (Unverified)
It is a nice example George. We see the information but the data is being proactively captured eg assigning the asset tags
[12:26 pm] Adam Sanders (External)
The key with these tools is choosing software with open APIs so that the data doesn't get siloed in a single bit of software. Being able to plug-in other functionality and software is what makes this data / information valuable.
[12:27 pm] David J. Hills (External)
Very interesting session - as someone who is new to BIM - we at Ark focus on supporting clients on meeting the requirements of the BSA and other H&S/Fire Safety requirements etc - it was interesting to hear some of the issues raised. We certainly experience a severe lack of information when undertaking the development and writing of building safety cases for existing buildings as well as when undertaking assessments, investigations and strategies. Building Owners just do not have or don't believe that they have, any information especially if they are 3rd/4th generation owners - those FM's who support them also seem to struggle. As a team who are writing the BSC's and submitting these to the Regulator, this makes justifying the safety of a building for a client extremely complex. I also note that the session focused very heavily on fire when building safety also includes the structural elements as well. TBH justifying the structural design and condition of a building in a SCR is our and our clients, major headache.
[12:27 pm] Martin McDonald (External)
we use openspace on majority of projects at ISG its an amazing bit of software - especially when you can track instal from 360 photos against drawings
[12:27 pm] Ali Imam (External)
George,
Apologies for not being able to attend the entire session. I am particularly interested in the information management workstream for existing buildings. The critical issue for me is the standardisation of data for these buildings. Following the tragic Grenfell incident and the unfortunate death of poor Awaab in Rochdale. The impact of these events has driven housing executives to push for a bulk refresh of stock survey data and to carry out surveys in bulk numbers. However, the current methods remain unchanged.
We need to discuss the possibility of conducting a one-time comprehensive and standard survey and establishing a process to keep this data updated and live.
[12:28 pm] Richard Bacon (Unverified)
Who is the Sodexo AMS representative?
[12:29 pm] Kemp, Anne C (External)
Great initiative - let's get the link on the Nima website as for BIM4Housing. Linking with BSA and others will be good too.
[12:29 pm] Harris, Joanna (External)
If you want some more info on handover and softlandings, asset management of the built environment have a look at CIBSE Guide M. Guide M Maintenance engineering and management (2023) | CIBSE
[12:30 pm] Chris Milling (Unverified)
Lets reframe to 'Digital Twins' and away from BIM
[01:04 pm] Sue Newton (External)
Hi - I have looked through the COBie standard and it is much more complicated that what our asset systems can deal with at the moment. Does anyone have a simple excel spreadsheet(s) of all the components that are generally handed over in a building with communal facilities i.e. an independent living scheme? I am not an asset manager but looking at how I can make our health and safety and compliance functions easier.
[01:14 pm] Victoria Finn (External)
Hi Sue, I have done a spreadsheet for all compliance handover for general builds I can pass on if you like?
[01:27 pm] Sue Newton (External)
That would be great - I have started building one but its a bit like painting the fourth bridge! Really appreciate it Victoria.